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S2E25 – Myrna Clayton – powered by Happy Scribe

The report here. All right, three, two, one, welcome. Welcome back to Boss podcast on today’s show. It’s interesting because, I mean, she’s an industry legend, right? And I’m going to give you a little bit of like of who she is, and then I’ll let her fill in with all the details. So she is a cultural ambassador for one, right? She’s a singer and performer. She is a producer, a non-profit leader, a social entrepreneur, a singer, performer, producer again. And you think about that, right? I said that twice for a reason. And then she’s also known as the American song-bird. I’ve deemed her the ambassador boss for obvious reasons. So without further do, Merner, the floor is yours.

Who are you? Wow, that’s that’s pretty. That that sounds good. Thank you. Thank you very much. Well, I am a creative cultural arts ambassador, and right now I’m deeming myself the performing arts pacesetter for post-pandemic live performances. That’s how I’m doing myself. But in addition to that, I am also a strong advocate for cultural exchange and for performing disability performing arts performing artists.

So let’s set the stage right now. Anyone that would look up your name, they’re going to be completely flooded with, like who you are and what your legacy. So, like, just to just tell a little piece of like, who are you and what have you done for your entire life?

My entire life.

Yeah. I mean, the reality is, is that you were born to do what you’re doing. So let’s talk about that.

OK, well, I’ve been singing since I was five and I recognized later on that it was a gift. When you’re complimented by things and just things that come natural, you don’t really know. But you kind of discover later on that it’s a gift. And so I was taught to go to college and get my master’s degree. So I have an MBA and worked in corporate America in marketing and marketing research, and so went along that path and then discovered that my ladder of success was on the wrong wall. And so I had to come down and move my ladder to the right wall, which is recognizing that space that made me most happy. And performing and singing is what made me most happy. And so I shifted and went in that direction, change careers and went in that direction. And so I’ve been performing a bandleader, solo artist, traveling around the world and kind of just kind of enjoying what I do and figuring out how to do it in a better way, in a different way than many of the artists that I’ve seen perform because I started in this career later, you know, than many others.

So, I mean, I want people to understand that I mean, you hear about artists and on a local level versus like a national level versus international level where you’ve had the pleasure to, like you said before, fly around the world. You had opportunities, I think, in Russia. So I’m not going to talk about that like that journey. To a certain extent. Most musicians or artists are content being in their their their country of origin but you seem like you’re more content being more of a global image.

Well, you know what? It’s funny. I can’t say that artists are content being in their local area. I think that they just don’t know how to get out and go further. And I’m I have the attention span of a gnat and I’m curious as a bird. And so I’m like, OK, there’s something else that has to be done. And in addition to that, and I have to give props to the Lord Almighty, because I actually heard in my spirit, worldwide ministry and music and ministry was not church, ministry was nations and that was very clear. That’s all I knew at the time. And so that was, you know, next year will be 20 years and is at that point that I knew the direction was international and and worldwide. And here’s the funny thing. I began asking people in the Atlanta area, hey, who books international, you know, asking questions, curious, how do I do this? Where do I go? And and I kid you not everybody that I asked said, I don’t know. When you find out, you tell me, you know. And so at that point, I decided to leave Atlanta for a minute, however long it was going to take. And a friend of mine invited me to come to D.C. She said, you could come here, you can stay, and you have a place to stay. You got food to eat and at that point, I was like, cool, you know? So I left Atlanta and went there thinking that I was going to ultimately get to New York. And while there, I began going to all the jam sessions so nobody knew me. So I began to go to all the jam sessions that performed so that I could get to know musicians and performers and everybody I. I was asking, do you know who books and I was that’s that was my focus. Do you know who books international? And while I was there, this gentleman said to me matter of factly, the State Department don’t you know, like know who would know that only people in D.C. would know that, you know? And so that is how I ultimately became aware. The State Department books performers to travel abroad. Now, my job was performing abroad before that, and that became through relationships by my tours to Russia, actually came while I was in D.C. and it wasn’t through the State Department. But I was. But because I was asking everybody that uncle, who do you know that books international, that that’s what started coming to me, you know? And so so that’s kind of how it started and how it moved in that direction.

Hmm. That’s interesting. So, I mean, obviously, when I started off this podcast, you know, I labeled you multiple different things. Right. And this this is like the perception of the world viewing in on you. So I’m going to ask you a question based upon your personal perception. If you can pick three to five words, define who you are, which three to five words would you choose the.

Ambassador, cultural ambassador, that’s two words, advocate. For underserved and underrepresented and ambitious. Of follower of Christ.

So being being your ambition, I mean, obviously ambition comes with a heavy baggage of weight behind it, like everyone that thinks about ambition, things about climbing up a corporate ladder or buying something, selling something, monopolizing something. So in your business, like right now, like what are your current ambitions?

My current ambition in my first of all, my business is all about cultural exchange. And so in that being about cultural exchange and the exchange of music, the exchange of of of entertainment worldwide, globally and the why is really wanting to build curiosity and interest around world peace. And that sounds like you want world peace. Is this a pageant? No, it’s not a pageant. There’s so much going on that’s totally out of our control. And so when I travel abroad, I’m representing three entities. When I travel one, I’m a woman, too. I’m a black person. Three, I’m an American. Depending upon who I meet, that’s a positive or negative. And so I’m going in saying, hey, you should be able to talk about these things in a different way. And so when I went to Russia, they actually that the consulate wife came to me actually and said what you said from that stage was more impactful than what we’ve been able to do in months, because I’m not a politician. I’m not someone who is going to go in and I’m talking people to people. I don’t have a public, you know, public I’m not elected. And so it’s about that it’s about that cultural exchange and it’s a global market. And I’m using the universal language of jazz, the universal language of music and jazz is perceived because of its improvization as the freedom music, you know. And so all of these things from a marketing standpoint are buzz words that really have authentic meaning. It’s not hype when we talk about it. It feels like hype, but it really resonates with people. And so because of that, we have the opportunities to to really make make things happen in a different way for other cultures, including America. Here’s the crazy thing. When I go abroad, I represent America. So that’s why I’m called America’s songbird, because they need to know that I’m American will. Other countries and other citizens are getting cultural exchange, but we in America aren’t getting cultural exchange, we aren’t getting to see the benefit of other cultures, not mind you, people live here, but we don’t interact with them. We don’t know anything about them. And one of the things that I say, because I have a show and let me know what I’m talking too much. I have a I have an event that’s called Atlanta International Jazz Artist series. And I feature international artists that are based in Italy, a top international artist based in Atlanta. And my whole goal is to have that cultural exchange for Atlantans to experience other cultures here. And yes, I’m doing what consul generals are supposed to be doing here in Atlanta. But OK, that’s all right, because I’m a cultural ambassador. My title has been I’ve been given that title by the State Department, and so I take that seriously. But one of the things I say each time when I’m presenting an artist is, look, if you don’t like Mexicans, then stop eating Mexican food, because if they had not come to this country, we would not be experiencing Mexican food. If you don’t like Chinese people, then stop eating Chinese food, because if they weren’t coming here, we wouldn’t experience that if you don’t like black people, stop eating soul food, stop eating Southern cooking, because it wasn’t for us being in this country, you wouldn’t have those benefits. You go to any other country. It doesn’t exist. And so that’s where I am in terms of really bringing to people’s attention the value of differences. That’s important. And once we understand and value differences, then we can then embrace our similarities and come together and and kind of be OK with OK is cool, is cool, you know, but it takes that that exchanging and that curiosity to to go there as a matter of fact, passports. You know, if a person has a passport, then we know that they’re interested and curious or those people who want a passport. So that’s that’s what my business is about, cultural exchange.

So I mean, in that I mean, obviously, you give it a lot of insight into finding that answer, but it kind of brings me to kind of like social awareness. Right. To your point, you say three things, right? You’re a woman. First, you’re African-American and you’re American in general. So when you step into these spaces, you’re either viewed as a triple threat threat. Right. Or you could be viewed as the three golden nuggets. So what is probably the biggest obstacle or hurdle that you had to overcome, being that you are those three things in the face of adversity?

You know, that’s an excellent question. The hurdle to overcome is someone else’s perception. That’s the hurdle, because I’m coming in. And if you already have a negative perception of me, then one, I don’t know what that perception is. And then two, I then have to overcome that. Let me give you an example. One of my very first times with athletes as a singer, of course, as I mentioned, I started a little later than many and the publicist of one of the these well-known legendary jazz and popular culture producer, filmmaker, soundtracks for movies and just amazing legendary man musician. The publicist for him came to me and said. You got the look, how old are you? I said, I can see you now. He asked me nothing about can you say it was all about the look and the age? It’s old since I knew that I was older than many getting started that was not something I wanted to discuss. I wanted to discuss the fact that I can sing and I can sell records, you know, but you have a perception of me. And so that that part of the reason why I just kind of go out and perform. I’m a performer and I’m an entertainer. And so that’s what I do. And so once I get on the stage and then you can then see what I do is at that point that we can talk about other things, you know.

So, I mean, that brings me to another question right in the industry. And you have music people that just love music like they don’t pay any attention to, like the back office or to like the business structure behind the scenes. But it’s like you’re kind of in the middle, like you are a diehard musician, but you also have the business savvy. And so you understand both sides of the coin. So my next question is like being that you understand both sides of the coin, how is your business set up?

Is it an LLC as corporally Corp is an LLC?

That’s an S corporation. OK, OK. And so it’s funny because I do masterclasses on the business of music and in workshops, because many universities, they teach their students how to be performers, but they don’t teach them the business side of things. And it’s it’s also funny because, you know, James Brown said it’s called show business. Twenty-five percent show. Seventy-five percent business. You know, it’s about the business, you know, and we don’t we don’t think about that because we are gifted. We do have a passion. And so, you know, as Erykah Badu, I’m sensitive about my stuff, so I’m sensitive about this. And so but at the end of the day, if it’s not you’re not able to make money at it, then somebody’s making money, but not, you know, and so you’ve got to figure out how to make money. And that that’s that’s where I am now in this virtual world, just trying to figure it out because it’s very different. Music is free now. And so how is songwriters making money? How are performers making money? I have an issue and my friends know to deem musicians as non-essential and essential if it wasn’t for the music. If people want at home listening to music, they’d be jumping off of bridges right now. So we are essential and and society again. These various society needs to recognize that we’re essential. We’re not nonessential. And so our music is what gets in it penetrates is that unseen value and other people don’t recognize it. But but we artists know that if it wasn’t for us, there would we did more for integration than any politician. Well, you know, I mean, Ray Charles and Mahalia Jackson and others, Watts and Billie Holiday was saying, I’m not going to perform if you don’t have an integrated audience. Long before the civil rights movement was signed, so it was performers and entertainers out there sacrificing their lives and their dollars.

So there’s definitely, definitely something. So I mean, and what I’m getting from that is essentially like being that you’re both I will say you’re 50 50, right? Your half and a little boy, your half creative. Right. Being that you have that advantage, I would think that you would have some particular systems in place. And through your point, you’re educating people, you’re doing master classes, you’re doing workshops. So what systems are you educating other musicians on to help them to process the analytical side that they’re neglecting because they’re more on the creative side?

You know, it’s first of all, let me preface this by saying I am the artist. And so for me to take myself out of myself and talk business, you know, I say to my friends, I’m a canopy’s and this canopy’s needs a label. It needs seasoning, it needs marketing, these pricing. It needs all of these things. But I’m a canopy’s that talks, you know, so it matters to me how you’re going to do this to me and whether or not I agree with it or not and so it’s very difficult. It’s very challenging to to do the things for yourself especially. But that said, the systems that I talk about are really basic business systems. The fact that you need a contract, the fact that you need an attorney, the fact that you need an account, just basic business, business. And so it’s basic business you need to promote. So many artists don’t self-promote. They’re expecting the event to promote for them as opposed to promote themselves, you know, and so they don’t know how to they don’t know how and they don’t know the value or the need to and so it’s really talking basic business acumen for for them. And at that point, once we get there, once we have that awareness and that level of understanding, is that point that I’m able to talk about, things like right now, it’s very important to me to learn from experts like you in this, how to how to monetize this virtual world, understanding the importance of our website, our our social media. And, you know, for someone like me, social media is a hodgepodge but for you, it’s naming each one of them, you know, and you have a different strategy for each one. And so it becomes very much so strategic planning. Well, for the average person who’s never been even never even thought of music as a business, whoa, hold up. You know, and so when you talk systems, I know that the system as of March twenty twenty that brought in this virtual world is very different than the system of March twenty nineteen. Very well, and so what you’re doing to to to to get customers is very different today. You know, now in May, twenty, twenty-one, a whole year, a couple of months later, it’s totally different. And so I’m going to school, I’m going and learning, like I said, from experts and and utilizing the knowledge of experts, because, yes, I bring I bring a lot with me, but if I don’t continue to educate myself, then I’m going to be, you know, left behind and I’m not.But are there things that I have to do generationally that so I can’t be left behind? I’m a live to be 100 beyond performing. Let’s be clear

I see you doing that. I can see you see being that individual person being like one hundred eight years old, still harmonizing for sure.

Yeah, you go. There you go. I mean, I’ve got great leaders. Cicely Tyson. What I think she just kind of said, I’m tired. I’m ready to go now. You know, it’s just, you know, so so. Yeah.

So I mean, I think that definitely, definitely really, really, really intriguing and really interesting. Right. Because, again, you you’re taking all these years of experience and everybody’s listening to this podcast. If you have not Googled yet, I think you should Google her before this episode is over so you can kind of really see this legacy. Right, because so some people you may be perceived to be an overnight success. To some people, they’re like, oh, my God, it’s her.

Right. So it kind of bridged the gap between the two like. Back it up a little bit, like when when did your. What long did it take you to become who you are, like, when did it really start and when did you really realize that you’re this person? It has got to be able to influence the world.

Here’s the funny thing, Schnall, I’m still becoming I’m real clear, I’m still becoming, I am still emerging. I am still developing. I haven’t gotten there yet. Wherever there is. I haven’t gotten there yet. But it’s but the path was the first thing was acknowledging and accepting what it is that I love to do. So many people don’t take the time to really assess what they’re good at there. So we’re so busy running and doing what other people expect of us to do that we don’t stop and really assess.

You know, this doesn’t make me happy. OK, so what does not tell me? What doesn’t make you happy? Tell me what does make you happy and when you start figuring that out. And so I finally figured that out, which meant a significant career change, a significant financial change for me. But I, I was willing to take that risk. And so in that I began performing, of course, for free, because whatever you love to do, you do for free.

And then began perfecting my gift and my skill. And I used to sing down at underground Atlanta back in the early 20s for free. They didn’t pay me, however, for tips. And so I began mastering how what songs would draw people over, because only if they came over with they took me or my product, otherwise they’d be walking. So I had to figure out what’s what cover songs to sing, to get them to come over so that I could get paid.

And so I learned from there in addition. And from there, one of my very dear friends arranged me, hooked me up, I guess, if you will, with the owner of a restaurant is now closed called Machans. And I was their first weekly performer there every Friday night. And I performed there every Friday night for two and a half years. And there I learned not only one, that I’m I’m the bandleader. And so that means that I’m paying my musicians.

And so every week these musicians are getting paid. And so I’m providing a significant amount of money for them monthly. You know, that that’s coming through me. For them, it’s not pouring money into somebody else’s household. So I’m an employer, you know, and so this mindset of things. And so at Machans, I learned how to really entertain the audience because these people are eating, you know. And so here we are in front of the audience.

We’re not background music. We’re there. And so my goal became, OK, I want you, because they were known for their smoked food, the smoked meats and stuff. And so my goal every Friday night was to get someone who’s having a conversation with their friends to then be in the middle of a bite and look over at the band. And, you know, so to me, it became I’m looking to engage, I’m looking to draw you in, you know?

And so it’s that kind of me as a performer because I’m looking for entertainment. I go, I spend my money, I’m looking for entertainment. And so when I perform, I’m wanting some I assume somebody else wants that to and they want that entertainment. And so whatever productions or whatever shows I do, because now not only am I doing my own, I’m bringing other artists and doing other performers and giving them platforms to do the same. As a matter of fact, that’s what I want to do more than anything, is to not only me perform abroad, but me to facilitate others performing abroad.

And so but I’m going ahead to give them the opportunity and and to build my brand so that when people say, you know, when people know Clayton or the American songbird or my business, they see the tree worldwide is doing something. And there’s a a brand awareness of the quality and the level of entertainment that we’re going to bring.

So in that I think you talked about, there was a Segway. It was kind of a shift. So from the day to that shift, roughly, how long is that that that timeframe in.

Shift from the awareness to making it happen. Yeah, you’re starting the process for me. For me, that was at least about seven to seven to eight to nine to ten years, because, of course, I’m working in corporate. And so the the the thoughts of girl. Are you crazy personal conversations, me and the Lord, you know, conversations about. OK, wait, you want to do this, you know, and then moving and positioning myself, I literally told my mother, hey, I’m going to do this.

I may need to come home and stay with you. You know, me going because me me I was married, had a child and I my husband and I divorced. And so my child, I was I was I was at that point a single mom. And it was like, oh, wow. I never thought of myself as a single mom. I never call myself a single mom. But I had a daughter that needed to be taken care of.

And so all of these processes. So you ask the question to shift the awareness came before the shift came. And then because there was a lot of self talk, you know, how what and and in that I’m hearing the spirit. And and so at that point I’m like, OK, now I’ve got to do this. I have to do this. I can’t not do this. You know, I’m going to be miserable not. And the miserable, happy, miserable, happy.

I think I’ll choose happy and it’s OK. Let’s figure out how to earn and make a living being happy because all you going to pay me to do this. Oh, yay. You know, so then after that decision you ask but after that decision then came, OK, how do I start making money. And that’s where the business knowledge came because OK, I needed to differentiate myself from the competition. I needed to establish a brand image when I’m performing a certain look, all those things that you know about business, then at that point, you know, start going and then came looking at international, you know, that.

And so it was more it was more like that, just kind of going through those steps and the process now. And I hurt in twenty two from the Holy Spirit worldwide ministry and music. OK, and so just to give you a timeline like that happen as I was doing the transition and so that that time came. And so now it’s 20 years next to be 20 years and I’m still getting in that process if I’m not there yet. So so it’s been 20 plus years.

So take this right. I mean, obviously, when you’re singing and I’ve watched some of your performances online and it looks like like you’re there but you’re not there, it’s kind of like you’re traveling between space and time and you’re trying to connect history to the future, to the present all the same time in that moment that you’re singing. Right. So let’s take that. You’re singing, you’re harmonizing, and you can time travel back into time, right?

In the last twenty years. Thirty years, is there one thing that you would want to go back in time and do differently if you could do it all over you?

You know Schnall. I would have been obedient and to my girl to what the spirit was telling me to do, as opposed to second guessing and thinking that I knew better or because this was happening that I need to you know, it’s it’s following that inner knowing. As opposed to well, it doesn’t look now that so. So even if it was even if someone seemed to be a hindrance, ultimately I discovered they weren’t a hindrance, but I made them dead.

And so I’m really following following my good, my good, my inner, my inner. Knowing the Holy Spirit, I really want to refer to it. But it is really that I like it to be much more technical sounding. But for me, it’s that it literally is. Oh wow.

So. Let’s talk about, like, your history a little bit, right? I mean, obviously you went to school, you have the business savvy ness. You understand music to a level that most musicians would die for. Like does this combination of business and creativity and musical inclined, does that come from someone in your family? Do you come from an entrepreneurial background with like your dad, a musician or businessman? Like, what does it come from?

It’s a hodgepodge of. My father was a minister and a college professor who wasn’t an entrepreneur, if you will. He was an academician. However, he was a speaker. And so he got his side hustle speaking. My mom was a librarian archivist. She was actually the first archivist at the Martin Luther King Center for Social Change back in 69 when it first opened up right after dark. Fascinating. So my mom was in research and a librarian and she ultimately ultimately became the head of archives and special collections at the Library University.

However, my mom’s side hustle was Mary Kay. She was a Mary Kay director. So she saw Mary Kay. And so they both but but that was not either of their ambition to leave there and grow that business. It was because they were where they were. However, my grandmother, my mother’s mother, she both my parents, my dad, you know, ultimately had got a Ph.D. my mother had a master’s and my grandmother who didn’t finish high school, had property.

All had people working for her, you know, and always had money and, hey, you know, she always was able to lend and people could pay her back. And so it was my grandmother who is the one that that had that business and it was causing that called entrepreneurism. She just had her own independent thing going on. And so it was her. Now, music was both my mother and my father saying my father was a trumpeter and my father when he would pull out his trumpet, SCHNALL he would go someplace heavenly.

And I knew he was like he was he was talking with the Lord because he would he would be in his office playing once he pulled that trumpet out in that office. We knew, OK, stay out of the way. Is something going on up in here? You know? And so for me, that’s what spirituality and jazz go together. And I call what I do inspirational jazz, because the hope and the desire is to inspire someone to mind you.

Old jazz is when I started saying I do inspirational jazz. Of course, old jazz is all jazz is inspired. So I get that. I get that. But from a branding standpoint, me calling it versus bebop or fusion, you know, as a vocalist, I call it inspirational jazz. Wow.

Wow. So I mean, you alluded to I mean, your family history. You also mentioned that you have a child. So like being that you’re in a world, I mean, obviously in today’s market, travel is not as common. Right. But at one time, I think you traveled a lot, know, being that you were doing performances over in Europe and you were doing performances in Russia. So let’s talk about that for a minute. Like Turley’s, how do you juggle, like, your work life with your family life?

You know, I’m so grateful to have supportive family. I became a full time caregiver, primary caregiver, a full time caregiver of my mother in nineteen ninety nine. And so it’s been 20 years and I had to move in with my mom in 2009. And when I was doing all of this traveling and things, I actually had to say to my brother, hey, I’m not an only child. I need your help. I need you to step up, you know, and I think that many people who are caring for their parent don’t ask their siblings, you know, to, hey, can you can you can you give me an hour?

Can you give me a day? Can you give me some level of support? Because I’m I’m drowning here. And so that said, thankfully, my brother and my daughter and then family members, I learned that people people will help if you ask them. They’re not going to volunteer, but they will if you ask them, can can I get an hour? Can you help me? They’ll help those that are willing. You know, they will help.

And you don’t want to take advantage of that. But how did I manage that money with support and help from family? And it was it was a set amount of time. OK, if I’m going abroad, then I’m going abroad for a month. I’m going abroad for a few weeks. And then ultimately I had another conversation with my brother and said, hey, we have to alternate here, because when I’m going abroad, I’m not on vacation.

When I’m singing, I’m working. And so I still don’t get a break. And so thankfully, my brother agreed that every three months we would alternate where my mother would go and stay with him and my mother would come when I came back so I could schedule my shows and schedule my performances around when I’m abroad and when when when she’s going to be with him. And so it’s very much so scheduling. And I use the analogy of a juggler.

You know, it’s kind of like you when you got things going on, a girl was fleeing some stuff way up there and still be doing this. And then when that was time to come back down, OK, flings mills up there, you know, so it’s very much so managing systems, as you say, in order to make it to make it work. Because at the end of the day, again, I got to do what I got to do, you know, so I’ve got to find a way to do it.

And as you know, I do what I can and what I know to do. And then God just opened those doors.

Nice. So let’s just talk about, like, your your your routines. I mean, obviously it seems like, like you’re fifty fifty, but I think sometimes you’re probably very, very structured and sometimes you want to be very free spirited and that’s just based off me outside looking in. I could be a hundred percent wrong. Right.

So absolutely right. Again hybrid you know, because in the corporate world and and I’m in the corporate world in the nineties, in the late 80s, in the 90s. And so for women is very rigid. I mean, I wore a bow tie because for women to be respected, they had to have the illusion of looking at being, you know, being in that space, looking like a guy. Like a guy. Kind of a thing, and so we had to be very, very structured, very, very rigid and and so in the business world and I’m wearing that business hat, then that’s kind of how it is.

However, in the music creative world, it’s very flow, very, very fluid. And so it took a minute to adjust to that, you know, that flow. And now Dippin, I’m still adjusting, you know, because I do show up on time and I have an issue when people don’t show up on time, you know, or I let someone know if I have a conflict and I let you know in advance I don’t let you know the day before or God forbid, the day of, you know, where a lot of people don’t do that.

And so certain things. It’s a matter of respect. It’s a matter of of training. And so I recognize if somebody doesn’t do that, then either they’re disrespectful of people or they just don’t believe in train. They’re ignorant to the fact, you know, and so so so I am very disciplined, but I’m really work when I’m on stage and you say, oh, I’m I’m kind of there, you know? And when I come off stage, it’s at that point that it’s about it’s about business because I also do workshops and stuff.

When I’m in that mode, when I’m in a business mode, you know, then I’m there. But I find myself if I’m in a business mode, I’m a little bit more relaxed. If I’m in a performance mode, that I’m a little bit more structured. So that’s where is that? I want to get to the point where I’m flowing loan because the ocean, the river, they’re structured. They’re structured, they don’t, you know, unless something is disruptive, they stay right here, OK, you know, but they’re flowing and they’re getting it done, you know, and so I want to be like that flowing river, you know, that that’s that’s that’s that’s going about its business, doing it as the do you know, and sometimes forceful and sometimes just to keep it going.

So it’s interesting that you bring that up about being 50 50. So, like, I’m really intrigued by this next question. So what is your morning rituals, your morning habits look like?

Ever changing, ever changing. I’m trying to find something good because it’s crazy because I get up, I wake up at 7:00 or 8:00 in the morning and I get up and get my mom situated and everything. And then thankfully, now we have a companion for her. Praise God for Fulton County. We have a companion for her. But I am going to bed at midnight, 1:00 AM, you know, because I’ve got stuff that has to be done and things I have to do.

And so I’m getting up in the morning. And so you ask about my my morning routine. I get up, I make sure I drink 16 ounces of water. That lemon water or something like that, I am doing my affirmations and I’m reading my devotion and getting my head right, you know, because it’s about to go, you know, and then I look over my schedule, devotion, prayer, meditate, that that’s that I take I kind of take my time doing that.

I give myself an hour to do that while I’m just kind of chillin, you know, kind of a thing. I refuse to get up at six o’clock. I refuse to get up at five o’clock because that that to me is like corporate, you know. So I was going to be getting up at 8:00 and then my spirit was like, no, get up at 7:00. You know, it’s like seven to eight is when I have my devotion, spirit and prayer, meditation, time, drink, water, self care.

And then after that, I obviously had my meetings. But you ask me about the morning routine. It’s very much so self care. It’s very much so thoughtful. The last thing that I do right is the night before and I sort of remind myself about what I have to do the next day. And so I refresh myself and say, OK, that’s what you got to do, you know? So I’ve learned through others, others teaching that the night before plan your next day, not the whole week, but plan your next day so that you know, when you get up in the morning, OK, click, click, click.

It can just go click, you know, real smooth.

Got it. So I think I think that definitely is based upon your personality, I mean, and this next question is kind of falls under that as well. Right. And I’m just thinking about, OK, like, you’re obviously highly educated, but you don’t come across as someone that particularly has the time to read what you’re getting a lot of information. So this next question is a three part question, right? Like what books have you read on your journey that that helped you get to where you are currently?

What are you reading right now? I think you alluded to reading devotions and have you had opportunity to write or authors any books as of yet?

Well, thank you for asking that about the author part. I just led what I called a paradigm success intensive during the first quarter where I invited friends of mine to go through Napoleon Hills, the law of success and its 16 lessons. And so went through that. And that was oh, you know, but but I’m one who says I don’t want to reinvent the wheel. There are people who know this stuff. And let me just follow. That’s called that’s called learned wisdom as opposed to earned wisdom.

I have to go to the steps of somebody else has done it. And so the law of success by Napoleon Hill. And I was like, OK, this guy wrote this published this book in nineteen twenty eight, one hundred years ago, basically, and. They were millionaires then when when the average income for an average person was seven, eight thousand dollars, you know, it’s so OK, wow, I need to learn from them. The other piece of that is speaking very candidly is, OK, why didn’t my dad because my dad was an avid reader.

Why did my dad tell me about that book that maybe he didn’t know about that book? And so a lot of information we didn’t know about and our parents didn’t know about to even tell us, you know, nineteen twenty eight. My dad weren’t even born yet, but but they didn’t know to even go in that direction. But anyway, that’s the whole side of the story. But that’s the book that I just finished. And I did it as an audio book because, you know, just like the downtime, I’ve got to, you know, again, I’m trying I’m in school.

But also I am in the process now of reading two books. One is called Resonate by Alex Wolff, and the other is called All About All About Love by Bell Hooks. And that speaks to that hybrid kind of kind of a thing because, you know, Alex, Wolf, as you know, is just an influencer, social media. And, you know, she wrote this book, the book is awesome. I you, me with them with the book.

Not familiar with the book, with the author.

OK, well, she’s written a book and a young girl in her 20s. And so just just really just her her angle on it. As a person who’s not trained from a textbook, you know, it’s just fascinating from a marketing standpoint and the things that she’s saying. And so I encourage you to to check out the book. But those are two you know, I’m reading both book The Softer Flow Love Side and the and wanting to understand me again.

It’s about self-awareness. How can I be better, better myself and and better. Better others.

And just think about the opposite. Have you had opportunity to write any books?

I actually am in the process of and is being illustrated now. I’ve written a book, a children’s book for, for the disability community. I, I have a nonprofit that works with performing artists with disabilities. And one of the challenges within this population is us. You know, the general population. We create barriers unintentionally, but we create barriers. And so I wanted to do a children’s book to help change the stigma narrative of the disability community, because I met people who are very, you know, skilled.

It’s just different, who are very talented. They’re just different. And so that whole valuing differences is very important to me. And so this I wrote children’s book is being illustrated right now. And I’m excited. I’m really excited about it because it’s because disability has so many diverse it’s so diverse within itself. You know, there are people that are blind, deaf. We’re familiar with them, quadriplegic, paraplegic. But there’s also persons who are just have dyslexia that’s considered a disability, post-traumatic stress disorder, military persons, all of those with disabilities.

That and disability. The word you’re disabled. You know, you can’t function, you can’t be. This is such a harsh word. And so rather than looking at the challenges, let’s look at what they can do and what their abilities are. And so that’s what this book is about. It’s called I am able to tell You.

And it is it under your name or using a pen name or are not?

It’s going to be under my name, Myrna Clayton. You know, it’s so funny because I went through I changed my name. Should I give you know, I went through all of those things and discussions and I have a hard enough time trying to keep up with with passwords and look look, can we keep it simple? It’s me. Look, give me vertically, you know, so I mean, obviously you have like you’ve been on a hell of a journey, right?

You have a legacy that’s behind you that’s kind of following in your shadow. But where do you see yourself 20 years from now? Because I know whatever you’re planning on doing, you haven’t even accomplished it yet.

Twenty years. Now I’m going to be on somebodies beach in a picture with a picturesque background and performing, performing on stage and also bringing others along with me, introducing them to the world. Because when I say somebodies beach, I’ve been on beaches all around the world and they’re beautiful. Imagine my favorite beaches, Gulf Shores, Alabama. I’ve been everywhere, Bermuda, lots of places, Nigeria, beaches there. But my favorite is Gulf Shores, Alabama, because that’s where my family’s from.

But also, it’s beautiful. The Gulf the Gulf is beautiful. But to be able to. Do my passion, do what I love and share it with others and show them to me that’s what generational wealth is. It’s not just your own own independent individual family, but to show others how to do it, too. That’s what you do, should all show others how to make it do what it do, you know. And that’s where, you know, where we talk about don’t give a person fish, teach them how to fish.

You know, it’s that kind of desire. And so I am an educator. I am a teacher, you know, counselor. I’m constantly giving people advice even if they don’t want it. So I have to check myself because I’ve gotten to a point now where because I don’t talk about my MBA, I don’t talk about that when I’m with people. And so when I’m when I’m giving advice or something, especially as relates to business, you know, someone will say, I’m so glad we chatted as a whole lot.

You didn’t say to you what I’m sharing with you, what I’m imparting to you is not something that your friend down the street would be would be sharing with you. This is a value and all by the way, when you make your million, I want one percent. I want that one percent of a million will suit me mighty fine, especially if six or seven of them. That’s the residual because that’s what, one percent of gross, not net NBA speaking right there, one percent of gross sales.

So, yeah, that’s what I want. And that’s what I want to be able to do 20 years from now. I’m wanting to choose where I want to go. I want to have five houses and yes, that passive income. But I go and go where I want to, based on the web, based on the climate, based on the atmosphere. You know, I used I tell the story when I sing what I want, when I sing Somewhere Over the Rainbow, which a lot of people love that song.

I talk well, you know, while the music is going, I’ll say, you know, the birds have it right. When when it gets dangerous, they fly away, they fly away. They don’t just kind of stay in it. And so is this American songbird. Let me just go someplace else where is good and chill and welcome. I want to be where I’m appreciated, not tolerated. So let me just go where I’m loved and appreciated.

You want to give me a hard time? Well, I’m not going I’m not going to put my energy into that. I’m just going to go over here because I’m a fighter. I’m a fighter, you know, and I want to choose my battles as opposed to have someone choose them for me. Because when I find I fight to win and I don’t I don’t do it this way. I’ma do it. I’m a go talk to your boss’s boss.

I’m a go talk to the decision makers. You know, because I talk and deal with with persons who are really as above their pay grade, you know, you know that I’m wasting my energy. I want to get the test done. And so I learned in corporate politics how to play those games. I don’t like playing them, which is why I’m part of partly why I’m not there anymore, but I know how to play them. I was taught well.

Yeah.

I mean, I think that that is a gift and a curse for like any entrepreneur, if you have not to work for corporate America, you kind of have to learn that. And it always the perception is that most entrepreneurs become very cutthroat very quickly. But corporate America is cutthroat. They just put sugar on top. That’s that’s the only difference is if it’s a skill to kind of articulate particular things in a particular fashion, like you said, is going to the decision maker versus actually talking to someone that’s just going to argue with no results.

So I definitely appreciate you bringing that topic up. So going into like I mean, you’re in multiple facets of multiple different industries, like what software are you using to kind of manage or orchestrate the different things that you’re doing? Oh.

Uh. OK. When I was in corporate, I had tech support. And I would just call them and say, can you come help me, please help me, because I really value persons with gifts and skills. And so I prefaced that by saying I’m having to learn love being in school. I’m having to learn about what tools to use. And so as weird as this virtual world enters, you know, me learning what’s the best platform, whether it be zoom or stream yard or other platforms to use to be able to get the message out.

What type of sound, you know, sound equipment to use. And so I’m not wanting to necessarily name because they not look, they’re not paying me to I’d much rather promote Bosson case than somebody who’s not sponsoring me. I want to be sponsored. I want to to be able to use product and and and and product placement. OK, that’s the NBA coming. I want to have product placement, but I utilize the email. I’m trying to get to the point where I utilize the email systems because I have a lot of emails, but they’re not they’re not managed.

Unfortunately, I’m a dinosaur, you know, in that respect. And I want to I know what needs to be done. I just haven’t yet learned how to do it. And so I’m going to have to utilize the expertize of of others. Yes. We’re on social media. Yes, I’m on Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn and I have YouTube channel and I have a website, you know, I have all of that. But it’s very different when you’re doing it for yourself versus doing it for someone else.

As I said, I’m this canopy’s, you know, and so so so those are the things those are the platforms that I use. And then when I’m performing, you know, I use because I’m operating in this virtual world. But I’m I’m also I told you, I’m part of this post pandemic live performance. I’m this pacesetter for that. And so I am really trying to see how to do live shows, you know, in in the in this in this environment.

And so I’m looking and studying how best to do that. And maybe you can help me, Schnall, because here’s the thing. We just did a an event and we charge for tickets and we utilized a ticket service, go through the names, but we utilize the ticket service and we promoted it artist again, I don’t know how to promote, but they did as best they could to promote. And people aren’t purchasing from music. They’re getting free concerts.

All day, every day, live and recorded or staged video. And so how do we have a live show that someone’s willing to pay for that? Now I’m watching the live concert on my computer. Then a fun. I’m watching the live concert on my TV, all my phone, that is fun, and I got to pay for that. How do we as entertainers get through to make it engaging, to make it entertaining and you’re willing to pay?

And so that’s that’s where I am thinking strategically as a business person who this is what I do for a living. How do I do that? When when you’ve got what is it, Verver? You know, whether know the artist you got Earth, Wind and Fire and the Isley Brothers. And I’m sorry, I don’t want to watch them play their music, the records and make fun of me and then talk about it. That’s cool. But I’m not going to sit and sit there and watch them for two hours.

I’m not. I’d rather go out and see I’ll do it live and have the experience, you know. And so I’m really looking for technology because I’m looking to create new technology that allows for us to have the experience. You know, the closest thing to that is, is a watch party. You know, but I’m not communicating, that’s through I’m not able to see you. You know, it’s all I’m wanting to get with some creative’s, you know, in this new virtual world.

How do we have that live experience? Well, you know, I don’t know.

I think I think it’s going to be kind of difficult in a sense, because what you ask for it is kind of like how do we do a Woodstock without people being in Woodstock and thinking about like the magical Woodstock was? It was not only about the music, it was also about the people being among each other. So the only way you can kind of get into that space in that mindset is being exclusive. And I think that’s where things are going to go.

Like maybe you don’t do ten thousand people. Maybe you have an exclusive event on one day where is just one hundred people that not only could they hear the live performance, but they have an opportunity to interview or conversation or mix and mingle, kind of like the VIP status with the musician live. And that kind of changes things because of the small community of people that you’re talking to and then you can take their content and regurgitated to the masses.

And well, that that’s very much so what Prince was doing, you know, a long time ago with his exclusive group, and he would connect and be giving them new product and free product and talking to them and things like that, I don’t that is a way. But I would hate is kind of like kids going to virtual school and not being able to go to the prom, you know, those of us who know what that’s like. Oh, wow, you’re missing something.

If you know, how can we give you that feeling? There’s an old school movie called Sleep Around if you ever saw a movie. But it’s it’s it’s with I don’t remember the guy’s name, but anyway, a movie called Sleeper, I think it came out in the 70s before my time. But I remember I remember watching it because folks were talking about it anyway. It’s very much so futuristic. And he was he was he was literally having sex by touching a ball.

He had the sensation of just touching a ball, you know, I mean, literally like a beach ball, you know, and and so it’s that kind of thing that, OK, how can we have the experience, you know? It’s like being able to smell through my computer. How can I smell a smell of a sizzling steak? I can see it, but I can’t. Or a beautiful aroma lavender that I don’t. I don’t know that we’re going to ever get there.

But short of that, how can I have a live experience? And yes, it’s exclusive. And yes, it’s nice. And it’s a VIP setting and it’s a VIP thing. But if I can’t if I can’t touch you, we’re already having people that can’t communicate because all they’re doing is texting their community, fixing. And I can’t talk to each other. They haven’t learned how to engage. And so we have to we who know better. To me, I think that we’re we’re the bridge.

It’s our responsibility to allow them to be able to do that. Otherwise, the movie The Matrix is for real. You know, I like to think that it’s not for real, but it’s it’s coming true and true. So God bless that system, that black girl that wrote that movie that those guys tried to steal from her. So, you know, so so it’s it’s very much so from a tech standpoint. This is where we are. And I would much rather my training in corporate was a new product and new business development.

And so I’m a. A a forward thinker, and so that’s what I’m over here because, yes, there are people like yourself and others who know how to do this because you guys were forward thinking a few years ago to where you can do this now. So I would much rather work work with barter, with pay folks to be able to support me with this while I’m working with somebody else or with with you to say, OK, how do we do this?

Because I’m asking what’s going to be happening in 20 years. You know, I may be even able to not fly somewhere, but just teleport myself, you know, to that beach and not be I mean, literally, I’m there not thinking, you know, visualize and I’m there, you know, so. Yeah. So that’s kind of how my little brain goes. It’s kind of kind of out there.

So let’s talk about, like, words of wisdom. Right. And I think that you are designed to talk to any generation. So I’m not going to say a 15 year old. I’m not going to say someone dirty and say someone 70s. If you want to give someone some insight and say I’ll deem them as musicians, what words of wisdom would you give to a musician to get them on track to be successful in their art form and successful in their business?

Two things, one, I would say. Embrace your gift. Your uniqueness. Embrace that. And then perfect that because that will make you your money, that will make you have freedom, that will allow you that will open doors that you never could have imagined. But just starting with that gift, that gift that you had nothing to do with getting you was imparted in you and you don’t know why you have it. Some of it connected with DNA, some of us just like anybody.

I don’t know why I have it, but I got it. And so you you embrace that uniqueness of yours in yourself and then work on perfecting it, because that’s the way you say to the gift, the giver of the gift, how much you appreciate the gift. He was kind of like when something when you’ve given a person a gift and they they got tossed into the set, you think I’ll give them another gift? You could be like, oh, but if they say, oh thank you and they start using it, then you want to give them some more stuff, you know.

And so that’s how I see the father in that I’ve been given a gift. And I know it’s I know now I can’t say that I always knew, but I know now that it’s a gift. And so there’s a responsibility of me to perfect it and to share it with the world. But worth as your gift to make room for you to use that to make money and to better others. And so it’s for the betterment of humanity, it sure to use your gift, and so for those people, it may not be singing, it may be speaking, it may be using your skills, it may be your thoughts.

It may be your gift of making money to give money. Who knows what your gift is, but embrace it as opposed to and say as opposed to but and defend your gift, because somebody will say, well, that’s not that’s not what you’re supposed to be doing. So did you talk to God, I know what what I heard in my ear and Abraham heard in his ear and he believed that and he went for it. So whatever you hear in your ear.

You need to go with that, and until you given differently, then go with it and perfected. That’s that’s that’s my advice. Perfected, you already know. So use that and go with what you know, because other people will tell you all kinds of things. And if it makes you uncomfortable and it makes you not happy, you can. Discomfort is all about going after your gear, because if you if you were comfortable, then you’re not stretching yourself.

And so you got to stretch yourself. So the discomfort is my side. Oh, I’m uncomfortable. I know. I’m going in the right direction. I’m stretching myself. This is not nice. I don’t like this, but I know I’m going in the right direction. But if I’m comfortable and I’m chilling and lay back and you ain’t going nowhere and you’re you’re you’re you’re complacent. You’re complacent. So that’ll be nice.

Wow. Definitely insightful. So how can people find you online? I mean, you talked about your social media profile. You talked about a website like I want you to name some of these items so we can kind of get people in contact with you.

OK, well, the best way is to go to my website. It’s just simple. Myrna Clayton, dot com, unfancy Clayton dot com, also Facebook, I, I do a lot of posts on Facebook. I love that Facebook generation. I do have a presence on Twitter. I don’t have a presence on Instagram. I do have a presence on LinkedIn. And that’s that’s what I have a presence there. But I haven’t gotten haven’t grown up yet.

So this is I’m still still developing in those spaces, but I know that I have to. And so this year is about doing that. It’s about getting those skills and building those skills to be able to do that. But the best way is I’m straight old school. Email me. You know, old school is call me. But, you know, now we check in. Know I do. I have this number in my phone, so I’m like, OK.

And so, you know, but the best way to contact me because this to my through my website, because that will send an email to me or if people want to email my company, it’s Cedar Tree worldwide at Gmail dot com. I see the tree worldwide at Gmail dot com. And so that’s my that’s my company.

So I got a bonus question for you. Right. I was a you sang a song, hundreds, probably even thousands of songs. If you had to pick one song right now, this was the last song you’re ever going to sing right now in this moment, what song would it be and why?

OK, can I can I, can I can I give you a rounded answer to get there?

By all means, because neither of these people, neither these three people are that’s the song belongs to. So my favorite singer in the whole entire world. To Minnie Ripperton and Nancy Wilson. Love, love, love them. My favorite business music business person is Bessie Smith. And she was a business mogul and an amazing singer at a time when there was not technology, yet she owned her own train. She had her own sound equipment. She had on her own marketing team.

And so she was a businesswoman at a time when. People didn’t like black people and the business being a male dominated folks don’t appreciate women being leaders, you know, so Bessie Smith, but my favorite, the song, if I had only one song to sing in this song, I’ve sung in every country where I performed. And the song is What a Wonderful World by Louis Armstrong. And I say sing that song because we’re more alike than we’re different.

And I say to the audience, when I smile, it looks like your smile when I found it looks like your frown when you cut me, I bleed red just like you. So we’re more alike than we are. Then we’re different. So can we get along? Can we not fight? And that’s my converse every time I’ve sung that song in every country that I’ve sung. And so if there was one song, it would be What a wonderful world, because it is.

It’s a wonderful world that we’re living in. And we can either enjoy the beautiful sun or the pouring rain and have a relaxing time or just be upset because something happened.

Stephanie, I could definitely see you embracing that song, I mean, based upon who you are and just like the way you answer the questions on today’s show, I could definitely see that being a song that would be your last song if you would ever sing one. So I definitely appreciate that. I got another bonus question for you.

OK, one more or ask as many as you like. Perfect.

So if you could spend 24 hours with anyone dead or alive, uninterrupted, twenty four hours, who would it be and why?

Well, I’ve already kind of answered that that would be Bessie Smith. And as I indicated before, you know how she was able to to do this. I would ask her, how did she do that without. You know, Instagram without a major marketing budget. How were you able to do what you did and make millions of dollars, certainly million equivalent at that time? How do you do that with all of the negative going against you? So I would I would I would want to to talk with her because she’s like me, she’s a businesswoman, a musician, and so because of her, I want to because she learned from Morenae and yes.

To all kinds of conversations about, you know, a bunch of stuff. But I’m not interested in that. I’m interested in you entertained your audience and people came from miles around. They didn’t have cars. They came from miles around to hear a concert in a tent in the field. And so how did you do that? How did they know about you, you know, how, how? And and so I would want to apply that. Same.

Tenacity, that same knowledge.

Today, wow. I think you know that answer as well, right? So going at the closing of the park, as I mean, obviously as the interview progressed, you may have came up with questions that you may want to ask me. So this is the time of the episode where I give the microphone to you and the floor is yours, and you can ask me any question that may have come up.

Wow. Yay! OK. Hop, if for your advice to. What advice, I’ll say it this way, would you or have you given to entertainers that are shifting? From a. Shifting into subject matter, where are we coming from, shifting into a virtual world, because that’s where we are, we’re in a virtual world, we’ve gone from agriculture to industrial to technology to virtual because virtual is different than a technology world. You know, technology, as far as I’m concerned, used for person to person, still face to face technology, technology.

And that’s just my view of it. Obviously, you who are who are analytical and technical and artistic yourself probably have a very different view of that. But right now, whatever was before we virtual now we’re virtual world. And so how how would you suggest an artist? And also, as a caveat, there are no more record labels. You know, the record industry is very different. And so how would you suggest an artist not survive but thrive?

Yeah, it’s funny that you brought that up, because I think a recent episode was with Alex Johnson and Alex Johnson is a musician. Right. And, you know, he is creating content, creating videos. And we were just having, like a live Q&A style podcast where it was all about growth strategy. And to your point, in today’s world, it’s not that much different than back in the late 80s and early 90s. And we talked about this comparison about back then you would get records out of someone’s trunk, right.

There was no social media, but that person would drive around from location to location to location and broadcast about that particular record. Hey, I got CDs he heard on the car. Listen to some music and hear the sample. And I think technology is kind of stifled. Some of that to a certain extent, to where people have gotten lazy, they have lost the edge. So think about you driving from city to city, state to state, county to county, person to person.

And you’re promoting essentially one person at a time, 20 people at a time, anyone that would listen. But now you have a platform that you can do that to the masses. You don’t have to talk to one person. You can talk to thousands of people, hundreds of thousands, millions, even equivalent to billions of people. But people are not doing that in the environment. So back in the day, you would go out every single day.

Every single day you would hit the streets and you would try to promote and market your CD. And today you’ve only marketing your CD maybe once a day, maybe once every other day, maybe once a week. And then you’re scratching your head trying to figure out, like, why you’re not getting more sales. Well, there’s a bigger world with way more mass communication. So if you’re going to be heard, you’re going to have to be one more frequent and a lot louder, much like when we were selling CDs out the trunk of cars.

Wow, that’s that’s great, and that’s that’s good, and that even means even that much more why artists have to be businesspersons. Because because I do. I’m a student of masterpiece. You know, like I said, I go to school where it’s like, hey, why reinvent the wheel? There are people who done it. So let me learn from them. And so. So, yeah, that’s that that that that’s great. OK, what is up for music.

What is the best platforms. What are the best platform or what is the best platform for, for promoting. Or is there a system that you recommend for promoting music. One events to which. Which are different. Different. Two different answers. Yeah. Yeah. And there’s definitely overlap. I mean music is one of those things. It’s kind of are you trying to be mainstream and if you trying to be mainstream, then obviously going through some television outlet to kind of get to the masses and think about like MTV was like the dawn and video music box back in Brooklyn were kind of that epicenter to kind of have this content where you could sit down and watch a channel all day, all night and see this content.

So what’s the equivalent to that? In today’s world where we have VEVO, we have all these other channels that have music ongoing. But YouTube is a channel that reaches out to I think it’s like two point one billion or close to that number right there in the billions. Right. So you can put content out there not only for free, but you can utilize this platform to market that content as well. And once you get to a certain size, you could also use your own content to monetize, which means you’re you’re selling ads for other people in between, like commercial spots for your current music.

So just understanding that principle of video first. Right. And they always say, like, you know, video killed the radio star. Well, in today’s world, everything is hand-held, right? There’s billions of people with handheld devices and even on Facebook, even on Twitter, even on Instagram, ticktock, YouTube. All of these environments have video components. And that’s the first thing if you’re looking for convergence, is to look for video first. So I always say start with video, start do video music, do more video music on a regular basis, and then you would take the actual video that you created from music and convert it into audio, do the video first, do the music second.

And I’m not saying that the quality needs to be less. I’m just saying think about like if we’re talking about hip hop artist, for example, Busta Rhymes in the 90s was like the Michael Jackson of the 80s for hip hop when he did a music video. It was an epic event. It was like a movie was being released and everyone and their mom was glued to the screen to see what crazy thing he’s going to do next with his quality of music.

Never suffered, but he put so much into his visuals that to this day, Busta Rhymes is one of the musically inclined legends of our time, not only for his music, but also for his video representation. So just think about that like you can do that. You know, I think little NAS is kind of coming into that space. His videos are like, you sit there and your mouth has to floor is more shock value than anything else.

But he understands the psychology of what people are going to be clingy to and what they’re going to be like when we talk about little sex videos thirty years from now because of what he did now. And it’s kind of like there’s nothing really new, but he is targeting people based upon the psychological aspects of it. That’s what in the 90s and that’s what Michael Jackson did 80s.

Now, that’s fascinating to me now, but because you have to do music first in order to make the video for the music. Right. But you’re saying, OK, but instead of putting the music out first, put the video out first, that music alone out first, put the video out first. That has the music with it. And let that let let that video visual be what the music rides on.

Think about sharing it right. If no matter if it’s food or if it’s how to create a product, majority of the things that are being shared are videos. You may get some images here and there, but you can’t have a still image and have a music associated to it. Right. So anything that you’re going to do that has motion, whether it’s sound motion or video motion, it needs to be a video. Right. You can separate the audio and deliver the audio.

But how often like check your cell phone, how often have you gotten the link to just audio check your Facebook. When’s the last time you got a link to just audio? OK, yeah. Even the live performances are. Still in the video format like that, Facebook Live is a golden nugget because now you have the interaction with the person that created the music and it’s this guy, his name is Mark, and he’s kind of like a musician guy.

He’s on Facebook Live every Sunday. He says the most craziest things, but he makes his beats right then and there. And when you’re sitting there, you’re like, who is this guy? He just did this live on the camera in front of me. It wasn’t there’s no studio behind them is just him and his board. And he’s mixing and mastering. And he starts singing right then and there. And you just kind of like, holy hell, you’re in the moment right then.

And there is because of the impact of the video, the music supports that you feel the music, you’re listening to it. But it’s also his visuals that’s changing the environment to where you’re, like, completely glued to the screen the entire time.

Wow. Wow, yeah, that’s that’s fascinating, and that’s that’s that’s what’s that’s what’s up knuckleheads going on. Yeah, yeah. OK, well, what about events.

Yeah. So events, it’s events are so difficult right now because like in-person events versus virtual events, it’s like the sky’s the limit. Like that’s just like the new green savior. Right. Could I mean you could pop up on a new software tomorrow and combine both of them. But, you know, Eventbrite has been around forever and they kind of have like a hold on it. But then you have webinars and any webinar platform essentially allows you to do an online event.

Right. You can even do Zoome online events. So just think of it from the standpoint. Use whatever works for you, whatever you’re comfortable with, and make sure it has the features. One feature that you want is to be able to monetize. So think about it from a standpoint. If I could monetize my webinar, how would I do that? I would. On the front end. I want to put something that that has a conversion for somebody to make a purchase point.

So whatever platform that you can say, hey, sign up for this, make a purchase and then I’ll give you access, that’s that’s the simplest way of looking at it. Don’t worry about the platform. Worry about the core functionality. Can I check someone in. Cannot verify that I get paid. Do they get access and then obviously you want to then follow up with them. And that’s the series of events when it comes out to whether it’s live events or localizations.

Wow. Wow. While I’m on the because I know you’re a systems guy, so I’m on the process the steps, because that’s what systems are there, steps that can be repeated, scale scaled. And so the repetition of it. Well, then with that that process, my audience is international and so local too. I mean, that local too. I tell people that America is included in international. You know, we’re right. Yeah, right.

But every time when I say international, they think I don’t do stuff in America. It was like, no, America is included in that. But anyway, there it’s within Facebook’s algorithms, which of course, I don’t know. But within their algorithm. First of all, is faith. Let me ask it that way is Facebook. The best way, because I have I have audiences that are abroad, you know, and all of the countries where I am, I’ve got Facebook friends, whatever Facebook is available, I’ve got Facebook friends.

And so how am I able to manipulate Facebook so that my audience. Can see, you know, what I have that’s available.

So I mean, Facebook. In partnership, well, not to say in partnership with the other Big Brother devil called Google, right. When it comes down to analytical data and Big Brother, it’s kind of you know, you have Facebook, you have Google and you’ve got you have Amazon. Right. So Facebook is essentially a platform that’s designed to not manipulate, but to understand the behavioral insight of their audience. Like so Facebook allows you to say, I want to target someone based upon their behavior versus Google is saying someone is looking for something.

Someone is typing in a key word. There are some behavioral stuff on Google, but Facebook is kind of like like the big brother in that sense. So what does that mean for you? That means for you is that you can go on Facebook and say, I want to look for people that are interested in just jazz or a type of jazz or type of blues or music, or you could actually target that country. You could target that region.

So part of that audience that you’re looking for, first and foremost, if you have an email address like that’s golden because a majority of the email addresses should be associated to a Facebook account if they have a Facebook account underneath that email address, once that person logs in via that email address, then Facebook knows exactly who that person is, what they do, whether they have dogs or cat, whether they like to swim or whether they like to eat ice cream while they’re in the hot tub.

Facebook knows that. So if you have the emails, then you could easily attach these emails and create what is called a look alike audience inside a Facebook and a look alike audience is saying, hey, I have this pool of people, this one hundred people per say, two hundred people Facebook. You have billions of people based upon your algorithm. You’re looking at these two hundred people. What is the commonality of these two? What do people what do these two older people all share now from the outside?

Looking in is going to be difficult for any individual person to unless you’re a computer across, analyze 200 people and find the common denominator. Facebook does it without thinking about it twice. So then you can say, hey, I want to find ten thousand people that share the same commonalities as these two hundred people. And now you have a look alike audience that now you could target a bigger pool of people that share the same commonalities in the same behaviors as your two hundred person email is.

But I don’t have the Wile E.. While Facebook has access to their email, I don’t have access to their names. You have access to their emails, but you may now know who they are, right. Think of it from a standpoint. That’s why you have lead magnets and somebody comes in. They’ll give you their their name and they’ll give you their email address. The second that you capture that email address, the next part of that is you want to facilitate and talk and communicate and then you want a pipeline that information back into Facebook to create these look alike audiences.

So you couldn’t target people like them, not just that person, but more people that has the same personality traits as that individual person. Now, once you find the new pool of people, Facebook is not going to give you that information. Right. There’s privacy laws. Right. So what these privacy laws that are in place, what Facebook can then do is then you could pay Facebook to communicate to these pool of people that Facebook has deemed to be much like the pool of people that you do have email addresses for.

So then that’s why you will see ads if you go online and you see similar ads over and over again on Facebook and the ads are usually targeted to you and you can’t help but to stop and to look at the click or save it, because Facebook knows that you love the information that they’re putting in front of you based upon the habits that you’ve done over the years of using Facebook.

Yeah, that’s that’s a whole nother conversation.

Oh, another. Another whole nother beast. But it’s very it’s very simplistic when you think about it, really thinking about, hey, if I know John likes to jump show me 20 other jobs that like to jump. It’s just that simple. And if I like John likes the job, I like John to jump over something. I want more people that jump over something. And then you say, I want somebody to jump up and do a backflip and you just layering in the pieces that you’re looking for.

So then you’re going to fire people that just know how to jump over something and then do a backflip versus just people that know how to jump or people that just know how to jump over something. So you’re isolating and you’re getting smaller and smaller now into your niche until you find the gymnast. Right. And that’s that’s a way of looking to find a gymnast is to think about people that like to jump, move forward, run back, flip stuff like that.

And you could introduce to them about becoming a gymnastic champion or whatever it is. It’s just a psychological way of looking at it, of breaking down based upon the personality habits and traits.

Well, with that, there are you can you can do Facebook and you can do you can boost. Your stuff. What’s the difference between and what is Facebook and I obviously don’t know this, and so I’m picking your brain now when I see something that a sponsor. Is that an ad or is that a boost or whether they’re one and the same? Think about it. The Facebook psychology is beautiful, right? Like, once you understand the principal psychology, all you have to do is rename something, right?

So I can say read and read. Am I talking about the color or. I’m talking about actually reading something. Yeah. Yeah. It’s all based upon perception. So you may see sponsored and say, OK, what a sponsored mean. And Facebook understands that, hence why they would boost. Why didn’t they just call Booth’s sponsor. Right. It was the same. But they understand that from a user standpoint, you look at the word boost and be like boose means increase.

Boost means uplift. Boutte’s means something positive. I need to do that. I need to boost my post. Right. That makes logical sense when I explain it that way. But on the back end, all it is, is that you’re paying money for them to show that particular thing that you’re boosting to a multiple audience. That’s the definition of an ad you’re advertising. You’re paying for someone to take something and present it to multiple other people.

So it’s my, my, my, my, my, my post versus I guess if I do Facebook advertising, it’s creating an ad is one and the same. But obviously Facebook advertising gives you way more control over your ad and your reach of who you’re going to communicate with. And you could target and you can sit down. It’s like being an average user versus being a pro user. The pro user has way more bells and whistles and way more control to target exactly what you want to do.

When you boost the post. You’re just saying, hey, take my five, ten, twenty dollars and you’ve got a million people Facebook that instead of three million people. But we all know that a million people may not be your target audience. Maybe ten thousand people. Maybe a thousand people. Well, you’re not going to know who is going to have access to that ad because you’re only going to spend twenty bucks and twenty bucks for a million people doesn’t even add up.

So you may end up getting a couple thousand. But which one thousand are you getting from that million. You don’t have no idea or no clue reboost.

Right. Right. OK, ok. Oh wow. That’s that’s very helpful. That’s like I just got an intensive Facebook lesson courses and it’s a master class. I like those, but as a matter of fact because it condenses everything, you got to be, you know, but but it gets there and it gets it gets to to that to that that answer. Wow. Thank you.

Well, I definitely appreciate you coming on the show today, and I appreciate your question. I love your questions because, I mean, it just it just kind of gives you the insight for you to process and think about what really goes on behind the scenes versus the perception of what people are seeing on Facebook. So I definitely appreciate that. So, yeah. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you for the opportunity. Thank you for insightful questions. Oh, my gosh. And and I appreciate your listeners. I appreciate your audience being attentive and and caring enough to hang around and to the end, you know. So I appreciate that. Thank you very much. I would love to come back again and talk to you, talk to you and talk to your listeners, your viewers excuse me, your viewers again to just kind of ta ta ta ta ta ta.

Share what I’ve learned, what I’ve done as a result of all the things I just learned from it all.

Well, I definitely appreciate it. Sagarin over now.